the principle row contended for, must be entitled to a salary on retiring from his office; but this, he presumed to think, would hardly be maintained.

The Solicitor-general for Scotland explained.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer said, that it was a matter of no minor consideration that, by the act, the judges held their situations quamdiu se bene gesserint; and that the case of the sheriffs of counties in Scotland, alluded to by an honourable gentleman, was not at all analogous, as such officers were not thereby removed from any profession in the duties of which they had been previously employed. He denied that these pensions were so much for the benefit of the individuals concerned, as for the benefit of the public, by securing an adequate and uninterrupted administration of justice.

Mr. Windham said, that the question ought to be ar gued upon the general principle of grants upon superannuation, and not upon the strained analogy of reducing the Scotch judges to the same standard as the judges of this country. Such an assimilation reminded him of the old fable, "How we apples swim!" And as to the plurality of duties, the division of such labour was more like the division of business between Jack and Tom: "What are you doing, Jack?" "Nothing, sir."-"What are you doing, Tom?" "Helping Jack, sir." (A laugh). Let gentlemen speak of it as they would, it was, after all, nothing more than spreading a small substance upon a great extent. It did appear to him to be a provision not at all called for..

Mr. R. Dundas thought it was a sufficient answer to the question why the Welch judges were not pensioned as well as the Scotch, to remind the house that the Welch judges had, with their appointment, the benefit of their practice; and of such importance was that privilege considered, that there were many English barristers who would not accept of the place of a Scotch judge, and who would yet be very glad to get that of a Welch judge. Gentle men on the other side had had recourse at the same time to two arguments that destroyed each other. It was ar gued that the place was a sinecure, and should not therefore have a pension on retirement; and at the same time it was apprehended that the Scotch judges would be anxious to retire and enjoy the profit of a pension without the trouble of the office. This was saying, it was and was

not a sinecure; one must be given up it must be ad mitted, either that, if it is a sinecure, there would not be such inducement to retire; or that it is not a sinecure, and therefore worthy of a future compensation, when the judge retires through old age or infirmity.

1

The committee then divided on the amendment:

Ayes
Noes

Majority

41

84

43

On the re-admission of strangers, the house was receiv ing the report of the committee of ways and means, and the different resolutions were severally read and agreed to and a bill ordered accordingly.

MILITARY INQUIRY.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer rose to move for leave to bring in a bill to revive and continue the powers of the commissioners of military inquiry. He hoped there would be no objection to pass this bill through all its stages as speedily as possible. A bill for this purpose had already passed both houses of parliament in this session, but by some accident, it had been omitted in the commission. which had passed the great seal for giving the royal as sent to bills agreed upon by both houses. In consequence of this omission, the powers of the commissioners had expired yesterday, and it became necessary to have this bill revived, to continue them.

The Speaker thought it right to make some observation on this case. It was contrary to the constitution that' bills agreed upon by both houses should lie in the other house without being noticed, when a commission from the great seal came down to give the royal assent to bills so agreed upon. There being no reason to suppose that the present case happened otherwise than by mere accident, the present motion might be sufficient.

After some conversation, in which Mr. Ponsonby sug gested the propriety of a special entry on the journals, the Speaker stated there was no parliamentary know ledge of the fact; to ascertain which, so as to warrant a special entry, a formal inquiry should be made in the house of lords; but that no irregularity would be seen on the journals of this house by proceeding without a special entry, as this case would appear to be the same as that

of a temporary bill to continue another, which otherwise would have expired before the continuing bill could receive the royal assent.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer offered some ob ervations to the same effect. Leave was given to bring in the bill, which was passed though its first and second reading, through the committee, and reported, and ordered to be read a third time to-morrow.

Mr. Grattan presented two petitions, which were laid on the table: one from certain grocers and spirit retailers in Dublin, praying relief against the operation of the spirit retail prohibition act; and the other from certain prisoners confined for debt in the sheriff's prison in Dublin, praying relief, &c.

LONDON VACCINE INSTITUTION.

Sir Thomas Turton presented a petition from the members of this institution, detailing their services in the great cause of vaccination, and praying the support of that house.

Mr. Fuller rose, and observed with considerable warmth," that a grosser forgery had never been submitted to that house.

The Speaker interrupted the honourable member, and reminded him that the petition had not yet been read; and that when it was, the house would be better enabled to judge of the nature of its contents.

Mr. Fuller resumed his seat amidst considerable laughter. The petition having been read, Sir Thomas Turton moved that it do lie on the table. f

Mr. Fuller again rose, and apologized for his abrupt manner of rising before. He said that this business was a gross cheat; a palpable trick to swindle the public; or, if it was not absolute swindling, it went very near the wind. When they found cause to solicit his subscription, be thought, from seeing the name of the duke of Richmond at their head, that they were merely some convivial corsporation (a laugh), but what did they turn out to be? A parcel of quakers or presbyterians, whatever they were called; they had got at first five guineas from him; but the moment he ected them, he threatened them with a Bow-street officer, and a charge for swindling; and the dread of detection soon frightened them into a restitution of his five guineas. What a shame then it was to see VOL. III-1808. 2 Y

their cause espoused by any man in that house! A member of parliament should be ashamed of having any thing to do with such fellows. He was not to suppose that the honourable baronet shared in their gains (a laugh). That gentleman might laugh if he pleased, and look and spout speeches like a lawyer, but it was a poor way to shew himself off, and to make a noise and stir for notoriety (a laugh). He hoped the house would not countenance such a piece of swindling.

Sir Thomas Turton was sorry the honourable gentleman was not in as good humour with himself as the house. seemed to be with him. He would say however, that it was not for that honourable gentleman to excite his resentment. The petition was then ordered to lie on the table.

The Irish glebe house bill was thrown out in conse quence of an amendment by the lords; but it appearing that their lordships had no intention to encroach on the privileges of the house, leave was given, on the motion of Sir Arthur Wellesley, to bring in another bill to the same effect.

The military commissioners bill was read a third time, and passed.

OYSTER FISHERY.

Mr.Western. rose, pursuant to notice, to move for leave to bring in a bill for the protection of the oyster fisheries. He stated, that stealing this sort of property had been considered felony at common law till the act of 1791, which had been considered as doing away the felony. A great capital and a vast number of hands were employed in this trade, which certainly deserved the protection of the law. The act of 1791 only imposed a penalty of 201. on the offender taking or attempting to take the oysters. This had been found inadequate to its purpose, and this was his reason for coming now to the house for this bill Leave given.

VACCINATION.

Mr. Rose postponed his motion respecting vaccination till Thursday next; but stated, that his object was to propose a central institution, under the management of the royal college of physicians, to distribute the virus over the kingdom. He did this from having witnessed a

ter.

great mortality resulting from the use of bad vaccine matThis was not a government measure, and he begged to be understood as having no particular partiality to any one of the present institutions more than another. His object was to give the best possible effect to the discovery of Dr. Jenner.

EAST INDIA AFFAIRS.

Mr. Creevey rosé, pursuant to notice, to move for a copy of an exposition of the affairs of the East India com `pany, which had been laid before the committee by the directors. A report had been already presented to the house by the East India committee, upon which a grant of money to the company was to be moved. His object was to have this paper before the house, in order that when gentlemen came to vote on the question, they might be as well informed on the subject as the committee. The honourable member stated that the first thing done by the committee was to call for a general statement of the affairs of the company from the directors. An exposition had accordingly been given in, giving a view gloomy enough of their situation. When the committee came to consider what security the company could give for any loan to be advanced to them, it was thonght best that they should present a petition to parliament, to be by the house referred to the committee. A petition was accordingly_presented; but there they had forgot all their dolours. They put off their Indian debt in a parenthesis, and made out a surplus at home of eight millions. This was referred to the committee, and what he complained of was, that they had adopted the petition as the ground of the report, and not the exposition. Delusive, therefore, as the Indian budgets had been, they were nothing to the delusion of this report. The honourable member observed, that he could see no good reason for refusing to produce this report, although he could conceive that many of the members of the committee would not much relish the idea of its being made public. The friends of lord Melvillé and of marquis Wellesley could not, perhaps, much desire to produce a paper in which the directors ascribed their distress to the board of controul constituted in 1781, and to the Mahratta war. Still, however, before the house could justly vote away the public money to the company,