Indian planters had made out their case, nobody who read the report could deny. It appeared from that, that several estates in Jamaica had been abandoned, and that others were likely to be abandoned unless some relief were afforded to the colonial trade. It should not be forgotten that the West Indian posssessions of this country yielded an income of between eight and nine millions, spent in this country; that the revenue in customs, excise, &c. on West Indian produce, amounted to five millions and a half annually; that the West Indian trade employed one-third of the shipping of the country; and that British manufactures to the amount of six millions were consumed in the West Indian market. When the committee had been first. appointed, he had apprehensions that if the landed gentlemen took a narrow view of the question, it would not be easy to carry the measure into effect. But as he did not impute the opposition of these gentlemen to any narrow views of advantage to themselves, he was not without hope that they would view the matter in another light; and that a provision to prohibit the distillation from cora till barley should sink to any given price, and then to allow it to be used in distilleries till it rose to a certain price, would be considered as a sufficient security for their interests, and induce them to acquiesce in the measure. This was the best mode of relieving the West Indian merchants, whom every body allowed to be in a situation requiring relief. No person but the late chancellor of the exchequer for Ireland had suggested any other remedy, viz. by lowering the duties on sugar; but that right honourable baronet must have been aware, that the last addition of three shillings per cwt. had been laid on by the late administration. About 400,000 quarters of malt were consumed in the distilleries, and three millions and a half in the breweries; and if it was not for the improve ment in science, the quantity of barley consumed in the breweries would be double what it is. It appeared that this country in:ported to the amount of 700.000 quarters of corn annually; and though he thanked God that he had no apprehension of a scarcity, yet he thought they ought to be apprehensive of the rise that might take place in the price of bread. A right honourable gentleman opposite (Mr. Ponsonby) had said, on a former night, that this measure would be a violation of the act of union; and that they ought not, under the temptation of an im

mediate convenience, to suspend the provisions of that act. No man more anxiously than himself wished that the articles of union between the two countries should be preserved from violation, so far as the principles of good faith required; but why was it necessary to adhere to the letter of these articles, in opposition to a measure of great public utility? All that was asked of Ireland was, that at a period of great distress to a valuable part of his majesty's subjects, whilst this country with a view to their relief suspended the distillation from corn, Ireland should suspend its export of spirits to this country. The right honourable gentleman then recapitulated his various ar guments, and concluded with expressing a hope that the measure, in the guarded shape he had suggested, would be acceded to.

Sir W. W. Wynne understood from all the accounts which could be collected, that there was no appearance of a scarcity of barley, or any other kind of grain, and therefore he saw no occasion for the present measure.

Mr. Barham argued, that he knew our usual con sumption of barley; and that Mr. Young, Mr. Wakefield, and others, examined on the part of the landed interest, agreed, that there had, during the last year, been a deficiency to the extent of a fourth, if not of a third. Taking it, however, at the lowest computation, and that it amounted only to a fourth, it remained that we must either bring down our consumption to our crop, or get an importation sufficient to make up the deficiency. In either case, the barley-grower could have no business with the mode of effecting this object; and if an adequate im portation could not be commanded, what better mode of diminishing the consumption to the extent of our crop could possibly be devised, than stopping the distilleries from using that article of necessary consumption? The price of barley, however, had risen from day to day til this measure was talked of; and would, but for it, have risen in a much higher ratio. This, he confessed, was not a measure of necessity so much as of precaution. He should ask his honourable friend, the member for Hamp shire, what was there held a remunerating price for barley land? If that honourable member had concluded the treaty for his farm in that county which was lately out of lease, probably he could satisfy the house on this head; at all events, he could undoubtedly inform them, that he VOL. III.-1808. S

had been offered more than double the former rent. This he himself (Mr. Barham) could assure the honse, he himself had received, aye, and more than double, for a farm in that neighbourhood. He was glad to take a remune rating rent where it could be had; for as so little remuneration was to be got from the West Indian property, it was necessary to take it where it could be procured. The honourable member for Norfolk could also, probably, inform the house, what was the remunerating rent in that county. He was confidentially informed, and believed, that within these few years, the rent of barley land had risen from three shillings to fifteen an acre. In Essex, he had been informed by an honourable member now present, the rents of such lands were wild and extravagant. The remunerating rent in Wales, he was informed, though probably nit in the immediate neighbourhood of the honourable baronet (sir W. W. Wynne), was four, five, and six times the former rent. Having stated what was e-teemed the remunerating rent for barley land to the landlord, he should himself mention what was supposed, in general, to be a proper remuneration for the farmers; and this, after paying the landlord, &c. and providing for their families, was neither more nor less than such a profit as should enable them, in the course of a few years, to purchase their farms: the fact boing, that of late years, the greater number of farms sold had been purchased by the occupiers of them; and nothing being more common, than for landlords desirous of disposing of their estates, to divide them into farms of 2007. or 3007. a year, and sell them to the tenants themselves. The price of lands, he contended, was too high, the profits of the farmers too great, the price of provisions exorbitant; and there was nobody to pay for this but that industrious and labouring class. who, when their strength and energy were exhausted, must expect in return to lead their days in a workhouse. If this measure had gone before three dif ferent committees, it might have appeared worse and worse, but could never have appeared in a different light from that which it now exhibited. The West Indian proprietors were a body who contributed more than any other to the exigencies of the state. They supplied about 17,000 men to the navy, and added to the commerce and manufactures of the country more than any other description of men; wbile, at the same time, from the regula

MAY 23.]

SUGAR-DISTILLATION.

acts.

tions which had been adopted, they hardly received, for their exertions, and as a return for the immense capital employed by them, a single farthing. This, it was to be observed, was not the act of Buonaparte, but of the government of this country. The amount of sugar imported into this country from our colonies was 250,0 0 hogsheads; the consumption amounted only to 200,009; but in addition to this excess quantity of 90,000 hogsheads, an addition of 60,000 hogsheads was forced in by the operation of our own Half of Jamaica was at this moment 'under foreclosure, and the remainder would soon be in a similar state. It was not to be expected that the blacks would continue tame observers of what was going on; and the most dangerous consequences were to be apprehended. The agreement with the West Indian proprietors, the honourable member contended, had not been kept. They had fulfilled their bargain, in supplying this country with the necessary quantity of sugar, and their reward was ruin; the landed proprietors of the kingdom had failed in furnishing the necessary supply of grain, and they were rewarded with a high price! The real cause of opposition to this measure consisted in a desire for exorbitant, gain. Here the landed proprietors were the stronger party; but when it came to be a question with the people of England, they would learn to change their tone. The ancient fable was here reversed; the stomach, which had long been fed by the exertions of the limbs, now refused to support them in return. He was afraid, it was in vain for him to think, that gentle men who were adverse to the measure from the motives he had mentioned, would be induced to forego their hostility. He should find, though conviction might flash on them for a moment, that the poet was correct when he stated,

A man convinced against his will,

Is of the same opinion still.

He observed with surprise, that this was made a sort of party question by gentlemen with whom he commonly acted. They seemed to think it yould be of consequence for them to beat ministers, even in a question like this. But did they really suppose, that a failure in this ineasure would cause ministers to change their situations, or would enable them (the opposition) to change theirs? It unquestionably would have no such effect. They would,

for the moment, become the dupes of a set of men who uniformly voted against them, who were then laughing in their sleeves at their credulity, and who, the moment they had gained their end, would skip over to the other side, and by their more than usually sedulous and obsequious attendance on the will of ministers during the remainder of the session, would endeavour to atone for their desertion in this single instance, which was dictated solely by motives of self-interest. There was one thing, however, connected with this subject, to which he wished to call the attention of the house, and of his right honourable friend (we presume, Mr. Ponsonby). Last night he had received a letter, at least the letter was addressed to him in the same way as it had been usual to send letters on parliamentary business, conceived in different shades of earnestness, according to the urgency of the subject. In this letter his attendance was particularly and earnestly requested in the house of commons this day, when the sugar business would come forward, and an early division take place. He mentioned this circumstance, conscious as he was that the letter was in the same hand-writing as usual, that his right honourable friend might have an opportunity of explaining the matter. If any person had presumed to practise an imposture, and to hold out the recommendation of a particular measure where no such recommendation was intended, he considered it to be a most unwarrantable and unjustifiable act.

Mr. R. Dundas concurred in the general principle laid down by his right honourable friend (the chancellor of the exchequer for Ireland) as to the propriety of not interfering with the corn laws, an interference which could not beroductive of any beneficial consequence. But at the same time, he must allow that there were extreme cases, in which it would be necessary to resort to such interfer ence. The question therefore was, whether the present circumstances of this country were such as to constitute a Case of that description. The late crops of barley and oats had been short, but not the crop of wheat. Though there were no danger of scarcity at present, yet they ought to look to the future; and in the event of a short crop this season, they would not be justified in not leaving to the executive gov rnment, the power of giving to the public consumption that amount of corn which was consumed in the distilleries, He did not agree either with