the injustice and unreasonableness of appropriating the whole ecclesiastical revenues of Ireland to a small minority of the

nation.

Sir George Grey said the Government did not consider it their duty to assent to the motion. If they did, it would be equally their duty to introduce a Bill giving effect to the meaning of the resolution, the terms of which, though ambiguous, raised the real question, not as to a reform of the Irish Church, but as to the continuance of its existence. That being the case, he would frankly say that Government were not prepared to undertake the responsibility of proposing any measure having such an object. That object could not be attained without inflicting great disasters upon Ireland, exciting much religious animosity, and postponing the period when, irrespective of creeds and politics, Irishmen would unite in promoting the moral and social improvement of their country. In the abstract, he admitted that an Established Church representing a small minority was indefensible; but the Irish Church was an institution resting on the unbroken prescription of centuries, and it could not be subverted without a revolution, accompanied by all its attendant horrors. The clergy performed their duties faithfully, unobtrusively, and zealously, with charity and an earnest desire to give no offence to their neighbours. True, there were side by side with them the unendowed clergy of the Roman Catholic Church; but they repudiated the wish to possess themselves of the property of the Established Church. As a matter of mere feeling, he allowed that the majority of the Irish people, professing another faith, had a grievance, but it was not a practical grievance, calling for any sweeping measure of legislation, such as that which the mover and seconder of the resolution had in view.

Mr. G. Hardy said the maintenance of the Protestant Church in Ireland was part of the compact made at the Union.. He denied that the Irish Church was a badge of servitude. By the act of Union, every Churchman in Ireland had a vested right to find in every parish a pastor, a church, and the means of grace in connexion with the church. That was the principle upon which the Irish Parliament, itself a Protestant institution, had given its assent to the Union. It was confirmed by the Roman Catholics themselves in 1829; and it would be unfair and unreasonable now to turn round upon the Protestants of Ireland, and tell them that they should not be treated as Churchmen were in this country, but that an entire separation should be made. between the conditions of the two Churches. If there were abuses, let them be remedied; but they had no right to take the property of the Church for the purposes of providing a remedy. They had no right, as the resolution proposed, to violate-first, the principles of the Reformation; secondly, the Act of Settlement; thirdly, the Act of Union; and fourthly, the settlement of 1829. The hon. member concluded by referring to statistics

tending to show the progress of the Church in Ireland, and the spread of free religious doctrines.

Mr. Whiteside concurred with Sir G. Grey that, to carry the motion in the sense of the speeches by which it had been supported, would tend to civil confusion in Ireland, the excitement of the worst feelings, and the general disturbance of society in that country. He argued that the Irish Church did not constitute a practical grievance to the Roman Catholics, because, although the endowments belonged to the Establishment, the Roman Catholics had 30,000l. a year for the College of Maynooth, 240,000l. a year for secular education, and, in addition, chaplains in the army and navy, workhouses, reformatories, and prisons, making a total money payment equivalent to 300,000l. per annum. The property of the Established Church, he maintained, was secured against invasion by the Act of Settlement and the Act of Union; the day the fundamental article in the last Act was withdrawn, the Union itself would be at an end. His argument for the Irish Church was not founded upon numbers, but upon the ground that the property of that Church belonged to it as an ancient corporation.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer entered fully into the various aspects of the question, and discussed the arguments which had been urged by Mr. Hardy and other advocates of the Irish Church in defence of the institution. He began by conceding some of the grounds on which its defence had been rested, especially with reference to the personal character and merits of the clergy. He agreed with Mr. Hardy that that Church did not present such an amount of flagrant abuse as would justify a violent interference with its existence. Its clergy were an earnest, zealous, and devoted body of ministers, faithful to their sacred functions in a degree not inferior to that of the clergy of any other branch of the Christian Church. With regard to its prelates, too, there were those among them who were known to be men of great learning, the highest character, and the most extensive charity both in act and opinion. And the general effect of the evidence was, that there was great social utility in the presence of a body of educated Christian gentlemen, such as the Protestant clergy of Ireland; and that if they were unhappily precluded from ministering to the wants of their neighbours in the most important respects for which they were appointed, yet in their social and moral influence they rendered valuable services to the community. All this, however, did not touch the essence of the question; and the object of Mr. Hardy was to put a negative not only upon the motion, but on the proposition contained in it, that the present situation of the Irish Church was unsatisfactory. Now, although the Government were unable to agree to the motion, they were not prepared to deny the abstract truth of that part of the resolution. They could not assert that the present position of the Establishment was satisfactory.

Mr. Gladstone then proceeded to deal with that portion of Mr. Hardy's argument which was founded upon the Act of Union, regarded as a perpetually binding contract. That position he held to be untenable. "His doctrine is, that by the Act of Union the Protestant people of England bound themselves to the Protestant minority of Ireland perpetually to maintain the Established Church in that country, with a view to supply the spiritual wants of that Protestant minority. I am bound to say that I must differ from the doctrine to which the hon. member appears to incline-that the Protestants in Ireland or the members of the Established Church in any one of the three kingdoms-for I believe them to be all on the same footing-are solely entitled to have provision made for their spiritual wants, without any regard being paid to the requirements of the remaining portion of the population. Neither our Constitution nor our history will warrant such a conclusion. There is not the slightest doubt that if the Church of England is a national Church, and that if the conditions upon which the ecclesiastical endowments are held were altered at the Reformation, that alteration was made mainly with the view that those endowments should be intrusted to a body ministering to the wants of a great majority of the people. I am bound to add my belief that those who directed the Government of this country in the reign of Queen Elizabeth acted on the firm conviction that that which had happened in England would happen in Ireland; and they would, probably, be not a little surprised if they could look down the vista of time and see that in the year 1864 the result of all their labours had been that, after 300 years, the Church which they endowed and established, ministered to the religious wants of only one-eighth or one-ninth part of the community. Before quitting the Act of Union, I may say that I do not deny the importance of such great statutes. In one sense they may be regarded as the landmarks of our Constitution. But the first responsibility of every Legislature in every age must be to adapt the laws and institutions of the country to the wants of the country which it governs, and it would indeed be a miserable excuse if we were to say that, although we did not think an institution was beneficial, we thought it ought to be maintained, and we would maintain it, because it was made by a parliament of men now dead, who while alive were not gifted with second-sight, and who were unable to foretell the circumstances in which we should be placed."

A view of the subject much more tenable than that just referred to was that of regarding the Protestant Establishment in the light of a Missionary Church. Viewing it in this aspect, which was far more rational than the theory of an exclusive privilege guaranteed to a certain section of the community by law, it was material to inquire what progress had been made by the institution in the course of years towards attaining its professed object.

"In the latter part of the 17th century an estimate was made

by Sir W. Petty of the relative strength of Protestants to Roman Catholics in Ireland. I now take all classes of Protestants together for the purpose of more convenient comparison, and I find the result he arrived at was-Roman Catholics, 800,000; Protestants, 300,000. The date of that estimate was followed by a century of application of most rigid penal laws. There is not, I apprehend, the least doubt that as regards particular classes of society those penal laws to a certain extent did their work, but yet they failed to impress the mass of the population. And now we come to the year 1834, the first year of any trustworthy and accurate religious enumeration of the people of Ireland, and we find that those who were represented in the time of Sir W. Petty by 800,000 and 300,000 had come to be respectively 6,400,000 of Roman Catholics and 1,500,000 of Protestants of various denominations. If the proportion between Roman Catholics and Protestants that existed in the time of Sir. W. Petty had been maintained, the Protestants of 1834 ought not to have been 1,500,000, but ought to have been 2,400,000. So far, therefore, under the operation of the system of law then established, although aided by the severest pressure of the power of the civil Government, -so far were we from making progress in the direction in which upon every religious ground we might desire, that much ground had actually been lost, and the proportion of Protestants to Roman Catholics was more unfavourable than it had been 150 years before. Mr. Hardy adverted to the census of 1861, and undoubtedly we find that the proportion of Protestants to Roman Catholics in 1861 is somewhat less unfavourable than it had been in 1834; for now, while the Roman Catholics are 4,500,000, the Protestants are 1,300,000. This apparent increase, however, may probably be set down to the fact that the emigration which so much reduced the whole population of Ireland, has been almost wholly a deduction from the Roman Catholic community."

After discussing the other topics which had been urged in behalf of the Protestant Establishment, the right hon. gentleman declared himself unable to come to any other conclusion than that the Church, as it now stood, was in a false position; nor could he refuse his assent to so much of Mr. Dilwyn's resolution as declared that its condition was at present unsatisfactory. With regard to the practical conclusion, however, it was much more difficult to decide: no one had ventured to propose the remedy required under the existing state of things. The consideration of this portion of the question raised a whole nest of political problems; for while the vast majority of the Irish people were opposed to the maintenance of large and liberal endowments for a fragment of the population, they repudiated any desire to appropriate those endowments, and firmly rejected all idea of receiving a State provision for themselves. In these circumstances, how, he asked, could the Government substitute a satis

factory for an admittedly unsatisfactory state of things? If the Administration could see their way to a settlement of this vexed question, they ought to grapple with the difficulty and cast their responsibility and influence into the scale. But if they could not do this, they ought not, by supporting the motion, to declare that the state of the Irish Church called for their early attention.

The adjournment of this debate was carried, upon a division, by 221 to 106; but, as before stated, was not resumed during the session.

CHAPTER II.

FINANCIAL AFFAIRS-Resolution moved by Sir Fitzroy Kelly in favour of a reduction of the Malt Duty-Arguments urged by the representatives of the agricultural interest against the tax-The President of the Board of Trade opposes the MotionThe "Previous Question" moved and carried against Sir F. Kelly by a majority of 251 to 170-Mr. Sheridan moves a Resolution in favour of a further reduction of the duties on Fire Insurance, which is opposed by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, but carried by a large majority.-The Budget-Mr. Gladstone makes his Financial Statement to the House of Commons on the 27th of April- He takes an elaborate survey of the finances and commerce of the country, and of the changes made in our fiscal system during the course of the existing Parliament -Highly favourable result of these changes upon trade and revenue-The estimates for the ensuing year show a considerable surplus-Appropriation of this balance-Reduction of Tea Duties, of Income Tax, of Fire Insurance Duty, and some other minor changes-Prospective views as to the Income Tax-Arguments against the abolition of the Malt DutyThe proposals of the Government are favourably received by the public-The Bill for giving effect to them passes without opposition, but with a protest from the opponents of the Malt Duty-Mr. Denman introduces a Resolution for relieving solicitors from the Licence Duty-It is opposed by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, is carried by a small majority, but produces no practical result.- Reduction in the Public Expenditure-The Army and Navy Estimates for the year exhibit a considerable decrease-Effects of this economy on reduction of taxation-The Army Estimates are moved and explained in full detail by the Marquis of HartingtonNumerous topics embraced in his statement-Expenditure, barracks, discipline, recruiting, improvements in ordnance small arms and general efficiency of the service-The statement is received with satisfaction by the House-The Naval Estimates are moved by Lord Clarence Paget, who states the expenditure required for our maritime establishment, the number of ships in commission, the number of men and boys required, and enters fully into the subject of iron plated vessels, and of the improvements in the dockyards-The details of the Estimates undergo much discussion in the House.--COLONIAL DEFENCES-Bill introduced by the Colonial Secretary for enabling the Colonies to provide themselves with means of maritime defence-Statement of the provisions of the measure, its favourable reception by Parliament, and passing of the Bill.-THE INDIAN BUDGET-Sir Charles Wood makes his annual Financial Statement at a late period of the session-The Resolutions are adopted with little discussion.

THE financial statement of this year was preceded by two motions made by members of the House of Commons for the purpose of obtaining a Parliamentary pledge for the remission of duties which they considered it of urgent importance to remove from our fiscal system. The first of these was the Malt Tax, for the repeal or modification of which a sort of desultory agitation had been